Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Partner goes out of business, 1 license over, completely locked interface, WONDERFUL!

    I find it ridiculous that being 1 license over, they can lock your entire production phone system. Sometimes companies can get wronged by their partner and the tedious process to switch partner, replace license orders can exceed the 45 day lock period. How can a company that pays tens of thousands of dollars and be one of their first major companies to use their product have their production system locked over 1 license!!!!!

    I know some of you will keep harping on the 45 days, but again, my point is first, I paid and should own all the phones and current licenses, they should always have the feature for me to remove a license no matter how long. Second, when you have remote locations that does not have a physical IT support person on staff, the reminders are not seen as often. I find this a joke and we will no longer purchase anymore Shoretel phones for any other locations. PM me for prices on our used IP 230's and 560's (total about 75) because we will not need these items soon.

  • #2
    While I can understand your frustration, let me point out a couple of facts to keep in mind. First: on most systems you would not have been able to turn on and use a license that you had not yet paid for, not even one. Second: note that even after you had been using the unpaid for license for more than the 45 day grace period, nothing stopped working, not even the license that was not paid for.

    Again I can understand your frustration, but for everyone else who is reading this, keep in mind that this is actually a quite easy and forgiving licensing solution compared to almost any other with which I am familiar.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by blanning View Post
      While I can understand your frustration, let me point out a couple of facts to keep in mind. First: on most systems you would not have been able to turn on and use a license that you had not yet paid for, not even one. Second: note that even after you had been using the unpaid for license for more than the 45 day grace period, nothing stopped working, not even the license that was not paid for.

      Again I can understand your frustration, but for everyone else who is reading this, keep in mind that this is actually a quite easy and forgiving licensing solution compared to almost any other with which I am familiar.
      Agreed :yes:

      Comment


      • #4
        My complaint is that customers are put into circumstances sometimes that will require some flexibility with this current process. With my situation, a lot of dead time was wasted when my "provider" decided to stop selling Shortel and not getting back into contact with me about this. Combine this with having to find another partner and then dealing with the paperwork needed to complete this, and add the insane paperwork process my company requires to setup vendor customer masters, the 45 day window is not enough. I also find it find it unacceptable to lock down a production system over 1 license, one I paid a lot of money for. I am definitely not a happy customer and I hope this thread will open Shoretel's eyes and other customers.

        Comment


        • #5
          license overage

          what license are you over on?
          many times you can just delete a license, get back into compliance, and re-add the license. It gives you another 45 days.

          If you already let yourself get locked out then you are hosed.

          it isnt very common for a parter to go out of business at the same time you are out of compliance on your licenses.

          Comment


          • #6
            What Ben says is completely true... Most (If not all) other vendors expect you to pay for the additional licenses up front, then wait for delivery etc.
            In addition, most partners have procedures for getting you unlocked.
            Worst case, you could call ShoreTel, and they can get you taken care of.
            Nothing stops working other than the admin interface locking down.

            Comment


            • #7
              I really think you are being a little over the top. I guess you would prefer that Shoretel not allow you to go over on your licenses? That way, if you need to add a new user, you have to have the license first. That would solve your problem.

              And it doesnt lock down the system, it just doesnt allow you to make any changes.

              Comment


              • #8
                +1 on the "Overreacting" vote.

                Good luck with your next phone system.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I disagree. Locking a production system for one license over is not acceptable. Its not the worst thing that Shoretel does (that would be beta testing on customers production systems and calling it 'GA') but it is certainly ridiculous. Word to the wise.. wait until many, many releases of a new major version before "upgrading" and test in your own lab first. Here's another word to the wise, get a test system.

                  The original licensing structure was completely self-audited. The VAR or installer could come by and check up and sell you licenses if you were out of compliance. It wasn't uncommon that you would have to enable a certain license that wasn't originally quoted to get a required feature and the unspoken rule was that after everything was stable and the install was complete, a license audit would be done by the VAR and any other licenses that were needed would be purchased. I suppose that system is now the same, but a lot of the flexibility offered to the customer and or the VAR is now gone.

                  I hear far too many Shoretel sales/cheerleaders voices and not enough critical end user voices. Its refreshing to me to hear an actual system admin speak up. I applaud your courage. I do think Shoretel is the best enterprise VoIP system around.. far better than Cisco.. (my desk phone is Cisco).. but it isn't perfect and certainly needs better testing (to include regression testing) before being released as "GA" and the licensing system needs to be revisited. It has always been confusing.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Licenses

                    I must REALLY be missing something. For example, I had 10 operator call manager licenses listed and only owned 2. I went into 8 of the accounts and switched them to professional call manager. The license warning/lock message goes away, because I am now "in compliance" Wait 10 minutes, add them back in. Lock avoided. I can do this as many times as I need until I get my licensing "right"......... each time you get back into compliance (even if its just for 1 minute), it gives you ANOTHER 45 days to square yourself away.

                    I know you cant do that with a system/MAC key, but dont replace your server when you vendor is out of business if you can avoid it.


                    This almost sounds like an admin that ignored/forgot about the lock warnings. As crappy as it is, I do see the need for it. I am no shoretel cheerleader. In fact, I have had some pretty rough things to say about them. The licensing just doesnt seem like that big of a deal.

                    Obviously you guys have never worked with Citrix licensing, or Autocad, or RSA, holy crap, RSA licensing..... you get the point.

                    Shoretel's licensing is actually easier than most.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Contractor View Post
                      I disagree. Locking a production system for one license over is not acceptable. Its not the worst thing that Shoretel does (that would be beta testing on customers production systems and calling it 'GA') but it is certainly ridiculous. Word to the wise.. wait until many, many releases of a new major version before "upgrading" and test in your own lab first. Here's another word to the wise, get a test system.

                      The original licensing structure was completely self-audited. The VAR or installer could come by and check up and sell you licenses if you were out of compliance. It wasn't uncommon that you would have to enable a certain license that wasn't originally quoted to get a required feature and the unspoken rule was that after everything was stable and the install was complete, a license audit would be done by the VAR and any other licenses that were needed would be purchased. I suppose that system is now the same, but a lot of the flexibility offered to the customer and or the VAR is now gone.

                      I hear far too many Shoretel sales/cheerleaders voices and not enough critical end user voices. Its refreshing to me to hear an actual system admin speak up. I applaud your courage. I do think Shoretel is the best enterprise VoIP system around.. far better than Cisco.. (my desk phone is Cisco).. but it isn't perfect and certainly needs better testing (to include regression testing) before being released as "GA" and the licensing system needs to be revisited. It has always been confusing.
                      I'm an end user and I see the licensing model as more than fair . It gives you 45 days to solve any licensing issues and, you can as already stated reset this count by coming back into compliance. I've had the occasional problem with new builds mostly very minor issues that are generally sorted quickly.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Wow, more feedback than I had expected

                        Just a couple of more thoughts on this since it seems to be getting A LOT more attention than I had expected, which usually means interest.

                        First lets clarify, it has been stated but I will say again, the system is NOT locked, the admin tool is locked when you are out of license compliance, but the phone system functions completely and in every respect even when the admin tool is locked. I realize that this is an inconvenience and at times even business affecting, but that is the result of ignoring 45 days worth of out of license warnings and I have trouble mustering much sympathy at that point. (A note for partners and admins out there, the system does a regular check for license compliance during nightly housekeeping and throws an event if you are not in compliance, so by setting an event filter for event #916 you can receive an e-mail the evening a system goes out of compliance and keep from getting in a bind like this in the first place)

                        Second, a little research might be in order before posting, anybody who has read many of my posts will know that almost as many of them are gripes about features that should be included or should work differently as any thing else. I have a list of about 8 enhancement requests in with ShroreTel right now trying to help make the system better. To be fair I am a ShoreTel fan, but only because I have worked on other systems and have never worked on one that was a better fit for the business need it tries to fill or was better thought through and implemented. But that does not make it perfect by a long shot and that is why I keep putting in and posting enhancement requests, to help make it better.

                        Third, I believe that you are mistaken about the beta testing, talk to a ShoreTel engineer sometime about the testing regime that they go through before making a release "CR" (not GA) and you will see what I mean. Also, at least in my experience, the relatively few build updates that come out on either CR or GA releases is a testament to good engineering and testing, when I look at most of our legacy systems they have dozens of patches after just a year. We do not make a habit of rolling out releases that we have not tested in our lab and then on our office system, but that is just good practice, it should not have to be said that you test everything on the bench before you install it.

                        Like I said, just a couple things to keep in mind since this is a forum that a lot of people read who are not as familiar with the ShoreTel product line and the installers and admins who weigh in regularly.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Contractor View Post
                          ... (that would be beta testing on customers production systems and calling it 'GA')...
                          So, how do you feel about Microsoft's beta testing? What, with their patches and updates...

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by crimson.falconer View Post
                            I'm an end user and I see the licensing model as more than fair . It gives you 45 days to solve any licensing issues and, you can as already stated reset this count by coming back into compliance. I've had the occasional problem with new builds mostly very minor issues that are generally sorted quickly.
                            I agree - the licensing model was one of the reasons we liked ShoreTel. In our opinion, it was much easier to understand than Cisco's model and we loved that you could go over on licenses for a few days for testing or because of an unexpected need. If I need the Operator call manager for a day to do testing or write documentation, I can easily do that.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Dude! Your tripping.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X